Celtic and Rangers in premier league?

(10-10-2009 12:22 )the bhoy Wrote:  

(10-10-2009 02:23 )DiduHearThat Wrote:  the bhoy your delusional celtic are shit

wit team u support then wee man

spurs

(10-10-2009 07:33 )admin Wrote:  

(09-10-2009 23:28 )Bunna Wrote:  To suggest that Liverpool are the weakest of the big four is insulting and typical of a southerner!

I didn't suggest any such thing. You're imagining things.

I selected Liverpool at random. That's why I said Liverpool for example.

Be honest you used Liverpool as an example because they are third out of the four in attendance average and last of the four in generated income,basing it on this is a fair example but definitely not random

The point I (obviously) failed to get across is that despite the behind the scenes turmoil at Anfield, Liverpool still finished ahead of the London
clubs who may have bigger attendances & equal or greater income. So yes, expectations for Celtic & Rangers would be high but the reality is,as for Man City is that they can have all the money in the world but what happens 'on the pitch' is not as much to do with 'off the pitch' as everyone makes out as Liverpool proved last season & as Everton have proved in the last five years by finishing ahead of richer or better attended clubs.

Let's get real here........IN NO WAY are Celtic or Rangers good enough to survive in the EPL with their current squads and it's myopic nonsense to suggest otherwise. They would probably both do well in the Championship, but it would take a massive influx of cash and an even bigger exodus/influx of playing staff at both clubs to stake a claim in the Premiership.

One only has to look at the quality of player that either club can currently attract, there's an awful lot of players over recent years that have previously failed at Premiership level that have wound up happily plying their trade at Celtic or Rangers. Speaks volumes if you ask me......Funny though how very few players from either club make a success of things going in the other direction? I'm sure that fans of Scottish football could collate a list, but without even thinking about it that hard i'm absolutely certain that there are far more, (double or even triple the amount) that have tried their luck at a Premiership club, only to wind up back north of the border, tails firmly between their legs.

To be honest this one's a total non-starter anyway, but if it were ever to happen it would be an unmitigated disaster for both teams.

craigiex3 Wrote:...also cardif have a realy good chance of the prem next season and its not a impossability that swansea could be there within the decade.

I have no objection to Welsh teams playing in the English Premier League, as these clubs started at the bottom and worked their way up under the old election system of entry to the league. If the Old Firm, or any other Scottish side for that matter, were to do the same (I.E. starting at the "bottom", such as the Northern Premier League, Conference North, or whatever the hell it's called this season) then I would have no objections to it at all. I'm uncomfortable with the idea of giving any side, from any country a free pass into the top flight. It's a suggestion motivated purely by money.

Twenty years ago, both Old Firm outfits - as well as Hearts, Hibs and maybe Aberdeen - would have slotted into the English top flight easily; the Old Firm would have been challenging for the title within a season or two. Ten years ago, the Old Firm would have taken slightly longer to adjust, but would have been pushing for honours by now. Doing it now, the Old Firm would be in genuine danger of relegation in their first season without massive investment. Scottish football is in a slump right now, both financially and in terms of the pool of talent available. I don't think this will last, these things tend to move in swings and roundabouts in football over the long term, but it's most definitely the case at the current time. A great deal of players for both Rangers and Celtic are simply not EPL quality players. (Papac & Miller or Caldwell & Maloney, as two quick examples off the top of my head) Both sides would need to inject huge sums to progress at a speed that their fans would be happy with.

The only way for the EPL and the Old Firm to protect that investment would be to provide an immunity from relegation for a prescribed period. On top of the slap in the face to two sides from the English league structure, be it by stopping promotion from The Championship or providing two extra relegation slots in the first season before or after the amalgamation, I think those actions would be a step too far in the slow corporate takeover of the game I love and one step closer to a closed, no-relegation "elite", such as that currently in place in another game I love, Rugby League.

On those grounds, I'm against the clubs joining the EPL. As stated above, I have no objections to the sides starting at the lower end of the scale and working their way up, just as I would expect any English club joining the Scottish structure to do the same.

-EDIT FOR CLARITY- *Final paragraph, first sentence:- "joining the EPL directly. As stated above, etc...."

Paulo Di Canio Did well both sides of the border. Craig Bellamy also.
Alan Thompson did well both sides of the border. I think the fact that you get players who are prolific out there not all that over here such as Sutton etc is a reflection of how poor the teams outside the old firm are, not a reflection of how poor rangers and Celtic are. Last season Celtic gave a good account of themselves against Barcelona. As mentioned before I don't think they would challenge the big four but they could compete with the likes of Villa, Spurs, Everton etc.

(09-10-2009 20:57 )desperateroger Wrote:  Cetic and Rangers should apply to join the Northern Premier Unibond League. if they got accepted it would only take 7 promotions to get into the Premier League.

If they didn't get accepted, where would they start then?

(10-10-2009 15:07 )setter1000 Wrote:  As mentioned before I don't think they would challenge the big four but they could compete with the likes of Villa, Spurs, Everton etc.

The current Celtic and Rangers squads as they are NOW, could compete with Villa, Spurs Everton etc?

That was a joke, right?

Certainly you are entitled to your opinion, but seriously, you must be kidding.......The standard of the current Celtic and Rangers squads is the lowest it's been for years, even the most diehard Scottish footie fan would admit that. Right now they'd struggle to give Bolton or Sunderland a decent game, never mind a mid-to-upper tier club like the three you mentioned.

(10-10-2009 15:23 )colino Wrote:  

(10-10-2009 15:07 )setter1000 Wrote:  As mentioned before I don't think they would challenge the big four but they could compete with the likes of Villa, Spurs, Everton etc.

The current Celtic and Rangers squads as they are NOW, could compete with Villa, Spurs Everton etc?

That was a joke, right?

Certainly you are entitled to your opinion, but seriously, you must be kidding.......The standard of the current Celtic and Rangers squads is the lowest it's been for years, even the most diehard Scottish footie fan would admit that. Right now they'd struggle to give Bolton or Sunderland a decent game, never mind a mid-to-upper tier club like the three you mentioned.

But on what basis of fact. Like you said it is just opinion. I dont think outside the top four we are that special. Look at how we do in the europa cup. Just going by last season Celtic acquitted themselves against Barcelona who strolled past everyone with the exception of Chelsea.

(10-10-2009 15:28 )setter1000 Wrote:  

(10-10-2009 15:23 )colino Wrote:  

(10-10-2009 15:07 )setter1000 Wrote:  As mentioned before I don't think they would challenge the big four but they could compete with the likes of Villa, Spurs, Everton etc.

The current Celtic and Rangers squads as they are NOW, could compete with Villa, Spurs Everton etc?

That was a joke, right?

Certainly you are entitled to your opinion, but seriously, you must be kidding.......The standard of the current Celtic and Rangers squads is the lowest it's been for years, even the most diehard Scottish footie fan would admit that. Right now they'd struggle to give Bolton or Sunderland a decent game, never mind a mid-to-upper tier club like the three you mentioned.

But on what basis of fact. Like you said it is just opinion. I dont think outside the top four we are that special. Look at how we do in the europa cup. Just going by last season Celtic acquitted themselves against Barcelona who strolled past everyone with the exception of Chelsea.

Well, if your'e using the Scottish clubs sorties in Europe as a basis for your argument, it's a pretty poor analogy.....There's always a lot of hype when either Celtic or Rangers meet Man U in Europe, but the end result is pretty much always the same, a VERY comfortable win for Utd. (and no, i'm not a Utd fan, far from it) A few weeks back i saw Arsenal put Celtic to the sword and let's be honest, barely broke into a sweat doing it.

And one decent performance against Barca does not a season make.... Even Strachan admitted afterwards that Celtic punched waaaaay above their weight in both legs, i doubt very much that they could rise to anywhere near those levels for 38 consecutive games, especially given that this season they are even weaker than they were last year.

these things are cyclical. Everton lost 6-1 at home to Arsenal, so when Celtic played Arsenal they were up against a side who were on top of their game and looked unbeatable. Even Man Utd were outclassed when they played Arsenal at the time even though they came away with an incredibly lucky win.