Post-Covid Evolution: What Babes are Keeping You 'in the Habit' and Why?

Premise: As babeland moves ever more towards a sole focus on 'individualised experiences' it's inevitable each user's engagement with the shows will devolve to center around fewer and fewer babes. (Iow, if there's less reason to 'just watch', users are less and less likely - when 'their' babes aren't on - to bother with/find/see enough of* other babes - and the channels in general - to get to the point of wanting to spend on them.)

* See question #3 below.

So... three questions:-

1. Do you agree with the premise above?

2. Who are your current essential babes? (I came to posting this thread on the realisation that every week Maria Smith and Atlanta aren't on is essentially, for me, a week without the shows!)

3. Do you, like me, evaluate a hot (a subjective first requirement obviously) babe on the payment methods she prioritises? (i.e. Any babe that doesn't want to work to the crowd-orientated style of presentation I'm looking to spend on can be disregarded from my usage.) For me, the channels are increasingly making all other considerations lapse into the background.

I'm sorry to opine on this when my first statement will be to reiterate that I no longer watch the channels, but I think I can offer a salient perspective.

Back when I did watch with frankly alarming regularity, of course I had my favourites (one famously in particular) and yes, when they weren't on I was infinitely less inclined to leave the channels on essentially just for the sake of it. So in simple terms, yes I do agree with your premise.

I cannot offer any answers on question two - I wouldn't know who 95% of them are anyway! But that brings me to question 3 because while I don't watch the channels anymore, I do use Chaturbate quite a lot, and the basic principle is exactly the same. It's largely structured around enticing people into the one on one experiences, but there are still plenty of group and "public" shows to be found too.

And so I can safely say yes, I do make a judgement based on similar criteria. It's not necessarily payment method - I'd call it maybe show preference - but certainly the public vs private thing is a major factor. And I'm on completely the opposite side of the coin to you Shandy. For me, it HAS to be a one on one, individualised experience, for the simple mindset of "why on earth would I be happy with other people (I may use the dreaded word freeloaders) watching for free while I'm the mug paying the money?

And this is particularly prevalent on the larger cam sites as most of the models - as I'm sure most of you know - are streaming on 2, 3, 4 different sites at once. So even if you think you're getting the private experience, bets are you're not. So yeah, that little minefield absolutely plays a large role in my decisions. I'll shut up now!

Varied opinions was what I was after, so thanks for offering your experiences Chris.And for bothering to read outside the BS thread!

It's simply different tastes isn't it? And your type stuff has won out on the channels in recent years for sure; you're clearly in the majority thesedays! (Having said that only BS has really survived the switch. The rest of the operators basically fucked up their paywall evolution - in one way or another! Along the way, quite a few well-regarded babes found the new style of working was not for them as well. That's another loss for us, of course.)

I imagined readers of traditional tastes would be inclined to favour the basic premise in the o.p., but it's good to see that even someone who's not looking to see 'fta' content per se can feel my basic rationale too.

(06-03-2025 22:44 )ChrisM Wrote:  ...why on earth would I be happy with other people (I may use the dreaded word freeloaders) watching for free while I'm the mug paying the money? ...

We'll have to agree to differ here too mate. (I find this aspect very interesting so please bear with me... ; ) I pay even though I'm aware of others watching along for nowt - and so do guys of tastes similar to mine. (I've spoken to quite a few of them over the years, including many of those callers that put the industry in the position it was back in the day.) It all depends on the particular babe paying a straight bat on this obviously. Over time, too many have made guys wary and supicious of fta tipping by using crafty pretemce in this area. (As an aside: I've said before how convenient it is for babes who favour strict paywall working that the "freeloader" narrative took hold so well with a certain type of user. Could it perhaps be a case of something we might dub "punter engineering" went on here?! BS seem to have found a lasting way to capitalise on the change in their user base either way.)

An analogy for you: I want a adult experience akin to something any music fan might be well familiar with - that of a regular gig goer. the sharing of a broad experience aided in its creation by the very crowd in attendance. Personally, I'd much rather that than pay a small fortune for say, Coldplay, to play in my front room; in front of me and a mere few fellow fanatics! Both have an appeal for sure, but the atmosphere will be ENTIRELY different just in the context that surrounds the music. In the old school babeshow, the intensity of even an invisible crowd can be felt visorally from its context and this is very much part of what I want to pay for.

I can give you three main specifics on why I favour the type of content I do - in spite of the objections you raise:

A. Interactions can be more cumulative. There's a 'build' of intensity and eroticism to the best of old school shows. Not an off-putting pause and reset for every punter's separate involvement. (How many of your 'individualized experiences' look anything like the best vids found on babevidz.net? All round, your credits are paying for quite a different beast - I'm sure you'll agree mate.)

B. The exciting sense of being part of a 'Bear Pit' of hungry users. When interacting, this is then accompanied by being a small part of bringing something notable to a broader fandom. There's even a further appeal in the recognition that comes from being known for doing the same.

C. Getting something that's supposed to be forbidden. To some of us, circumventing TV's silly rules in one way or another has an evocative pull all of its own.

None of this is anywhere to be found in the modern babeshow, basterdized by its various camming paywalls. Imo, the web is flooded with the sort of obvious adult material you find behind those paywalls. It's dull, and too easy - with almost pre-ordained results - in my eyes. The shows becoming 'more of the same' is exactly what pushed you away from the 900 operators wouldn't you say Chris? (In contrast Chaturbate, at least, have the experience, scale and ground-breaking user options BS can only aspire to.) Neither of us are thus satisfied with the current BS. The fta sparks the traditional babeshows could engender - and that I still seek - being simply hard to replicate away from the TV cameras and it's supposed "freeloaders".

Overall, all this means I'd rather pay - alongside others that are doing the same - for what I want (even if it means freeloaders getting an eyeful too) than pay through the nose for a faux intimacy I don't desire. (Privates that are not private are just the worst example of the fake nature of such interactions to my mind.)

For me, we've lost too much of what was once unique and appealing about the shows. Even up to around 2018, at least everyone benefited and could see the results from many interactions quite openly; when performers got it right that is. The effective wide self-promotion that brought has since been stymmied too many times - by babes that wanted the current system in its place. But the old way COULD be built back up even now... if tippers can find enough babes that are truly aligned with what the old schoolers want. And if the steadfast new regime insiders would allow it. Of course that's the biggest "if" of all!

(06-03-2025 22:44 )ChrisM Wrote:  ... It's not necessarily payment method - I'd call it maybe show preference

Agreed. I really meant the latter, of course, but I wanted to point out that the easiest way to spot the immediate difference in how babes work is in what button you're clicking when paying them!

It is different tastes, and ultimately you'd like to think there's room for every taste to be catered to somewhere in the grubby recesses of the internet. If I may address some of your points though:

Punter engineering, as you so wonderfully put it, is absolutely a thing. That said, I don't think the freeloader narrative was necessarily a convenience for some girls. I'm not an apologist for them by any stretch, but we have to remember they are working. They are there to earn money, be that for themselves or their employer, and that comes from the people paying, not the ones lurking. So natural instinct or management pressure is going to dictate prioritising the payer over the non-payer, and thus if I'm the payer, I'm going to get what I want, and not go along with some mob mentality just to feel like I'm part of a larger event.

And I know the counter to that is that if they engaged more with the group they'd get more in return, and on paper that's perfectly valid. The problem is, in practice the basic premise to which you refer is dead. The evolution of the whale saw that period in babeshows and camming off into history. Initially the whales didn't know better, so they'd pay in public and that encouraged more and more to watch for free, and that in turn led to the coining of the freeloader movement so they took their hunting behind the paywall.

Your analogy of a concert is well crafted, but you undercut your own preposition by claiming to enjoy the "bear pit of hungry users"...what bear pit is that then? 95% of viewers nowadays won't pay a penny in public for anything more than a hello. That said, I'm biased because I'm the sort of person who would much rather watch a movie at home alone than in a cinema. And if you offered me a free ticket to a Coldplay concert I'd probably rather jump off a bridge but that's just me!

You say you'd rather pay, alongside others that are doing the same, for what you want. The issue nowadays is if you're paying, others very likely won't. They'll let you pay for what you want and simply ride your coattails. Maybe it's a sign of the times, money is tighter than ever after all, but that's not something I'm willing to accept - I'm paying for the model's time and her attention, and I'm getting it exclusively or not at all. There are of course many models on CB who still have the big crowd funded shows, but from what I've seen they are very generic, and you'll get virtually zero individual interaction with the girl...and in my opinion at that point you might just as well be watching a pre-recorded video.

And lastly, no the "more of the same" is not what drove me from the 900's. While I fundamentally agree that the whole 900's debacle now is a shadow of it's former self, the primary influence for me was also financial. BS with their £5 per buzz and £5 per minute privates were laughably expensive even 5 years ago when I was at my most addicted. CB by comparison offers privates from as little as around 65p per minute (at current exchange rates), with a much larger selection of girls to choose from. On a value for money basis, it's literally night and day.

Look at us having a nuanced debate like adults!

(10-03-2025 00:06 )ChrisM Wrote:  Punter engineering, as you so wonderfully put it, is absolutely a thing. That said, I don't think the freeloader narrative was necessarily a convenience for some girls. I'm not an apologist for them by any stretch, but we have to remember they are working. They are there to earn money, be that for themselves or their employer, and that comes from the people paying, not the ones lurking. So natural instinct or management pressure is going to dictate prioritising the payer over the non-payer, and thus if I'm the payer, I'm going to get what I want, and not go along with some mob mentality just to feel like I'm part of a larger event.

And I know the counter to that is that if they engaged more with the group they'd get more in return, and on paper that's perfectly valid. The problem is, in practice the basic premise to which you refer is dead. The evolution of the whale saw that period in babeshows and camming off into history. Initially the whales didn't know better, so they'd pay in public and that encouraged more and more to watch for free, and that in turn led to the coining of the freeloader movement so they took their hunting behind the paywall.

I was someone who entertained the notion that if there was a show going on, it's more enticing for others to get involved and I would pay for non paywall interactions. While I may find it more enjoyable, I know it's not what's best for business.

The "Punter engineering" factor was just too much for me. The reality of a performer just trying to entice one (maybe two) whales by messaging them on OF or elsewhere during the show was a major turn off to me. The paranoid part of me just kept thinking.....
1) The Punter is intentionally asking the performer to do very little on FTA as a punishment for others not spending enough
2) The Punter may be using my tips and buzzes as a cue to enter a paywall interaction
3) The Performer sees the credits in the room and just goes for the easy route of only interacting with a whale who may or may not be watching (punters enjoy getting the PM about how much they are needed)

I wasn't interested in jumping into a private cold when the performer was doing very little, but that may sound like sour grapes. At the end of the day, they are doing shows to make a living.
The profitable shows aren't enjoyable to me, so I stopped watching.

Where would the fun be if we all thought the same?! With that in mind, I've some more in response here...

⦿ It takes a special kind of arrogance to think any other user shouldn't get a chance to have their kink provided for. Top spenders should get the most attention obviously, but they shouldn't be allowed to block others usage as PART OF their own enjoyment. And pandering to the whales as much as the shows have in recent times has certainly led to such dodgy motivations being indulged. That leads to much bad feeling in those who are on the wrong side of it. Many long-term fans have stepped back because of that.

⦿ I just wish more guys would think of what their money is effectively defunding/negating as well as what it's funding.

⦿ The doubt in my punter engineering statement was perhaps misplaced. I was thinking of who first used the freeloader term in regards the shows - babe or punter. As well as the when. Thinking about it again, I agree with Chris, neither of those things really puts the idea that it's happened in much doubt!

⦿ I'm sure babes have always used the freeloader slight with genuine feeling. Natural instinct must be to see lurkers as lost revenue instead of for any potential they may hold (both in terns of future revenue and other uses). But I do think this is both short-termism and limited thinking. For instance: Do they believe the shows would've been the thing they became without lurkers influencing others i(e.g. via this forum) into a habit that sometimes led to them becoming payers? Plus, has BS in particular not benefitted financially from its cultural impact on the UK? Does anyone that impact would've been anything like it was if it had started out behind some web paywall? Why distort all of what brought you to the place you hold? IMO, babeshows REQUIRE that central fta visibility in order to function. That easy accessibility comes with a certain amount of lurk-ability attached to it. Fighting that is silly and self-destructive ultimately. (Didn't the site-wide paywall and minimum credits limits over user access kill 66 stone DEAD a few years back? If that wasn't an object lesson for the industry I don't know what is.) BS have better standing than 66 did, for sure, but I still think: How much content behind paywalls would prove too much is the question.

⦿ No matter how the babes feel/felt about freeloaders, it doesn't mean their use of the term doesn't 'do a job' on the psychology of their paying punters - intentionally or not.

⦿ To call effective fta tipping "dead" is a bit of an exaggeration IMO. I've joined groups of tippers getting what we required from show only very recently. Not much further back, I even instigated group tipping activities in advance of certain shows. That was done off-site! (I'm not sure babes appreciate how much communication of that sort goes on. They should be looking out for it!) Why scorn such user investment just because it doesn't suit a paywall obsession?

The key to getting good fta content is finding the right babes, the right punters and the right circumstances. The babe has to be accepting of it and not try to spin it into something else. As I see it, If guys kinks are truly one thing, they can not be converted to something else and retain any lasting satisfaction. No punter should be dictated to in terms of how they should spend their own cash.

IMO, if tipping for fta is at death's door, it's intransigent babes that did the deed. Kill guys' confidence in getting satisfactory results and they will eventually conclude not to bother.

I'd say BS have put fta tipping on life support. And the danger is XP will eventually follow their bad example in doing so.

⦿ In his last post Chris seems to suggest the use of the freeloader term is fairly recent in this context. But I checked this a while back for another post. It's been used on this forum since at least mid-2009. It may even pre-date the forum. (Interesting isn't it that it must have been a sort of reverse loyalty badge for callers at that time. A loyalty badge not to be one. Readers can imagine how its use developed over time from there.)

⦿ As I've said there's always been a big majority in lurkers versus payers on the shows. That doesn't mean the former are of zero utility to the shows/babes (or even to my usage!).

⦿ Re. The analogy I used up thread: Cinema is totally different from gigs. Cinema-goers are supposed to be as quiet as possible and not make themselves part of the event (the fact people can't do this is helping kill off cinemas!). Gig-goers - like babeshow attendants - are supposed to add emphasis to proceedings. They are something to be WORKED by the affecting and effective performer. That's the absolute beauty of live events versus "non-live".

⦿ I can't stand Coldplay either! I was looking for something of ubiquitous popularism lol. How about Beyonce?!

⦿ Chris said himself that Privates are most often not really "exclusive". But I take his points on the subject. He's essentially saying he's after more of a 'sure thing'. And I can't knock that. It's perfectly valid view. But, as I've pointed out at length, not my thing. Parr of the excitement comes in the uncertainty of overcoming restrictions. And beating them makes getting results all the sweeter.

⦿ When I interact, I'm not overly concerned with the babe's chat/audio feedback to it either. For me, the important validation lies in what I see of how I affect the onscreen action; the camera moves, the babe's positioning, or the intensity of what follows my tip. (Tbf, this may also have something to do my formative babeshow lurking being done with the mute button very much on! lol.) The more I think the babe is working to my kink the more active my attention and interactions will be (paid and unpaid). Then, it's even better if my interaction convinces others to do the same. (It's bloody moronic XP don't include notification of tips in their chat box. Or even any obvious sense that babes see every tip when any alacrity.)

⦿ 90% of the fta shows have always been generic. But when that generic is no longer even meets the standards of basic eye candy and the exceptional golden nugget shows shrink to less than 1% of the total output... well, I feel the industry's is clearly signalling the trouble its in. They're not promoting effectively and not satisfying enough guys of varied taste to be properly sustainable. How many easily pleased whales can there be that are into the stuff they peddle?

⦿ I try to make my posts as short as possible I promise!

Ultimately Shandy I don't disagree with a word you say, and I'm certainly not narcissistic enough to think my particular preference of show is how every show should be. I've publicly stated on here before that my fascination with one particular girl - a girl who used to appear on TV regularly but slowly transitioned to being almost permanently behind a paywall - and the way I indulged her absence from the public eye probably contributed to her drop in popularity, and I retain a degree of inherent guilt about that.

I also didn't mean to imply freeloader was a recently coined term. Just that the movement of classing an entire subset of watchers under that umbrella was relatively new. Watchers who once would have been considered an untapped market got redesignated as chancers and time wasters and essentially cast aside, and that as you say undoubtedly led to the bad feeling and stepping back of many fans.

And yes, I accept it was an exaggeration to call the fta concept totally dead. I do believe it's dying, particularly in the TV field, but there are a few bastions left fighting that fight. You are of course totally accurate in the fact that S66 paid the ultimate sacrifice for going fully behind the paywall and it's worth stating that sites like Chaturbate have gone the other way, with the model being visible and in many cases communicative for free. It's just that 99% of them demand payment before doing anything of note!

Finally, I am 100% after a "sure thing" these days...I can't deny that. I spent a STUPID amount of money on Rampant back in the day and only with hindsight do I realise how little I got out of it, so now I absolutely focus on getting exactly what I want for the best possible value. I understand it's always a risk, but even now if I pay for a private and it ends up disappointing me, my primary annoyance is with myself for "wasting the money".

That'll do. Trying to keep my posts short too!!

The idea of an individualised experience has always been there for me going right back through my time as a prolific caller. I made a conscious effort to get what I wanted through approaching the call in a certain way and for the best part of nearly a decade succeeded a decent percentage of the time.
Some babes really enhanced the call and turned it into a telephonic sexual odyssey such as Clare Richards, Lola Knight and Rachel Taylor.
The change has been in the offer which has two strands to it.
The channel offer which has been polluted by vibratoys, pervcam, blurredcam, Mr P, ever more intrusive OSGs and blatant disreputable and incompetent practice. The dog eat dog culture of the channels created a monster that has gradually eaten itself alive. The net consequences of all this are several fold that in pure nightshow terms have been a disaster.
Only one channel left on BS up against one channel on Xpanded.
No Bang Babes, no RLC and most critically no Elite TV/S66.
BS is substantially wounded by the non nudity rule supposedly brought about by the Mary Whitehouse brigade of one. Consistent in his desire to ruin and destroy the remaining and most enticing visual spectacle BS had left.
The content creativity hub of Elite/S66 should have been inspiration to all others to respond in a spirit of positive competition to enhance the individual experience and collective one too.
The dog eat dog mentality speeded up the process of giving up on calls and instead shifting a focus towards a heady mix of rip off initiatives, scams and all manner of disreputable practice. The culture of anti freeloader sentiment completely took over to a degree where not only was the babes body their temple but the front door to view the temple was subject to a blurry tip goalometer . The only ones who claimed any sort of 'individual experience' were delusional in their belief it was meaningful or worthwhile on the basis of either having so much money they didn't know what to do with it or on the basis of thinking the babes actually cared about them. Or both. Yes, yes I know, I have become a miserable old git. Tell me something I don't know already .
The truth is that the individual channel experience has become polluted, conceited, disingenuous and flawed because it is based on an over inflated sense of self importance on the part of channels and the babes that represent them. Screw the gullable punters over every which way in the eternal pursuit of £s. From the point of view of the punter the only experience being suffered is exploitative ridicule.

Then there is the non channel strand characterised by onlyfans for BS babes and SoSpoilt for Xpanded ones.
In principle these sites should allow a more one to one meaningful 'experience'. In practice though, certainly in the case of OF even this has failed. And why? Chiefly because of babes not running their own accounts and getting someone to respond to messages on their behalf while sending out endless other messages to flog every video under the sun at vast and ridiculous expense. The babes in various ways maintain the body is my temple view while running endless competitions that often don't pay out in terms of obliging prizes. Endless customs purchased and either taking too long or not obliged at all or of such poor quality there was no point.
Of course there are some babes that can be trusted to offer a personalised and happy experience but they are ever dwindling in number.
The channel mentality has fed into the babe psyche to a depressing extent.

So who can I really trust in every respect? And I truly mean EVERY respect in the purest and fullest sense that I know of.
Only one I'm afraid. Beth Bennett.
That leaves out a few names that may be a surprise to many.
You will have to trust me when I say 'I have my reasons'.
Before I laud the many virtues of the world's greatest Kiwi export I should insert an unknown as yet caveat.
That of Bella Baby who I intend to buy a custom from at some point with relative confidence and hope it will be of excellent quality and reinvigorate my faith in the babe version of human nature. Based on all I have seen and heard from her so far I am willing to see what happens.

So to Beth Bennett.
Thirty three custom purchases later.
Several hundred calls later. Many many buzzes and tips later.
Countless fulfilled promises later. An honesty of endeavour unmatched in my entire time engaging with the babeshow product and it's side offerings.
A natural warmth, sincerity, believability yet healthy realism.
Conveying a clear understanding of a transactional yet just about personal enough one to one experience to make it fun but not obsessive.
Exciting but not irrational. Stimulating but not exploitative.
The best of both worlds. Channel and OF working in tandem and in unison to provide the very best in creativity, character, visual stimulation and a quality of telephonic and online exchange that is so far beyond what I have experienced elsewhere it is hard to even put into words.
The experience is wholly positive.
To such a point in fact where not only can I take pleasure in the content and entertainment she provides but also take genuine pleasure in her award successes of the last few years. She is a proper human being doing her thing in the best and most noble way. The very essence of my essential babe.

I evaluate a babe on character first, foremost and forever.
It is the quality of human that feeds into everything they do and everything they are. How they operate in payment methods is just one part of the puzzle.
How they communicate, how they come across, how they conduct themselves is absolutely paramount. Snooks seeks inspiration, hope and humility. The response from Beth has endured and will endure in the best way possible.
Through all my yesterdays and today and no doubt all my future days too.

Beth Bennett, the jewel in the crown and my new all time greatest babe.