Europe, Referendum & Brexit (formerly Europe..IN or OUT??)

The departing German ambassador to the UK has given a story to the Guardian.

It is an interesting article where he describes Britain standing alone mentality.

But he also mentions that due to the higher growth in the EU, it's resulting in lower immigrtion into the UK

(30-01-2018 09:19 )babelover48 Wrote:  it wasn't what we voted for is it?

^ Everyone that voted out voted for their own personal ideals. 17 million people had a slightly different version of what they wanted from putting their 'x' for Brexit. There's nothing wrong with that and voting for principals, but there was never a laid out manifesto of assurances of what final outcome would be sought. The Brexiteer politicians still cant agree on that.

Reality was hardly ever likely to play ball with ideals or such a disparate vision.

You were sold a willo the wisp.

The Remainers know what they voted for

Nice new government report today that, whatever deal the UK finally gets, our economy will be going down the chute. Well, that's nice, isn't it?

I voted leave knowing clearly it meant leaving the 'Single Market & the Customs Union' which was clearly stated by Cameron,Osborne & other Government ministers in debates & interviews prior to the EU vote.It was also articulated in the £9 million pro-eu publically funded literature the Government sent to every household which also stated that the Government would respect the result of the referendum whatever the result (but didn't say they wouldn't prepare for either result or Cameron resigning if he didn't get his way).

It does humour me when pro-eu politicians,newspaper columnists,tv commentators etc repeatedly trumpet the old line about people voting to leave to eu didn't vote to leave the single market as clearly remaining in it means accepting all the 4 freedoms of the eu.This would be like me saying to a remain voter that by staying in the EU means they would have to accept a single EU currency (dropping the pound),an ever closer union or accepting new EU expansion countries like Turkey,Ukraine etc it becomes meaningless,unfounded brick-bat throwing.

As for this 'so-called' leaked impact assessment projection of leaving the EU over the next 15 years by 'pro-eu' civil servants I wouldn't expect anything less from people who can't make predictions for the next 15 months let alone 15 years.
Scratch beneath the surface of it though & it's for projections for current existing models & makes no allowances for any potential trade deals.
Both EU & UK economies would suffer on a no/bad deal which is why I'm quietly confident a compromise deal will eventually be reached in a 'Canada' type deal.

Just for the record I'm not Jacob Rhys-Mogg in disguise.

Just to clarify I wasn't talking about the single market or any specific like that but neblus notions of "sovereignty", "taking back control of our own laws" and "controlling immigration". These are the sorts of things that people voted on. And these are things that were invoked quite deliberately with the recognition that they would mean subtley different things to different people, with little regard given to how these people could be satisfied in the event of a yes vote.

You can believe all you like that 17 million people had the same thing in mind as you when voting on this. That doesn't make it true. There was no even general consensus coming out of this vote. That's a politically satisfying myth.

As for a Canada type deal, it better include services or this country is royally screwed.

Andrew peirce calling george soros a non patriot wtf hes a hungarian america what a total fuckwit

The right wing are absolutely terrified of George Soros, he's a rich Jewish man and historically they haven't been big fans of those, of course the left has anti-Semitism problems as well but nobody on that side of the spectrum has ever built an oven for them.

Several months ago Farage wrote to numerous MEPs inquiring about any relationship they may have with Soros

http://www.politics.co.uk/comment-analys...-witchhunt

There seems far more paranoia in the press at the chances of Brexit being stopped, than any coherent truth in the matter. You'd think it was just an excuse to sell more newspapers in a doomed industry or sumfink.

And yet despite it being a doomed industry Trinity Mirror are buying the Daily Express from Desmond. I would love to think that this would mean an end to the hatred and bile that the Express spreads on a daily basis. However money talks, Desmond clearly feels that it is more important than his principles otherwise he wouldn't have sold it to a pro Labour publisher but I cant help but feel that if Trinity are looking to make money out of this they would be best sticking to the formula of hatred that makes the Express so popular, it would be an unusual move to buy a paper to silence it

(09-02-2018 15:22 )southsidestu Wrote:  And yet despite it being a doomed industry Trinity Mirror are buying the Daily Express from Desmond.

I should have said that proved it was a dying industry.
Amazing that Desmond was boss for 18 years.

Quote:I would love to think that this would mean an end to the hatred and bile that the Express spreads on a daily basis.

You took the words right out of my mouth! Today's JRM cover feels like a new low for a good & decent country.
I assume Desmond sold the naughtier bits (!) of his empire long ago, I doubt the Mirror would want them, except to shut them down.