Scottish Independence (the sequel)

(19-09-2014 19:51 )SOCATOA Wrote:  Now that Salmond has announced he wont seek relection, all the politicians who have been slagging him of are suddenly full of respect for Salmonds political skills and dealings. Just goes to show how shitty the world of politics really is.

No, it's called professional etiquette. What would have been shitty would be Cameron coming out of Downing St and saying "good fucking riddance", even if that's what he really thought.

Anyone interested in some cheap t-shirts

Sadly its not just 46% of Scots that are sick of Westminster. Central government doesnt work, and hasnt in the last 50 years, but Westminster will never change as its just the south east of England that really matters. Whole areas of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland run down and desolate, and Westminster doesnt care. Britain is slipping backwards due to The money peoples greed, and sadly this will never change.

Only way for it to change would to make Voting Compulsory but there would be an None of the Above Option after one election where none of the above wins they would all change there collective tunes

Was listening to the radio phone-ins this morning.
Amazing the number of Yes voters who claim to want a fairer society, yet who seem to struggle with the concept of democracy itself.

Yeah how they got fucked over by the english although it was a scottish refrendum and it was scottish councils and Scottish Elections office that did it that must mean the SNP Win last time was rigged by the english as it was the same system as they used on thursday

I had a good look at the returns this morning.

In short, the older and richer you were, the more likely you were to vote "NO". Younger and more working class were much more likely to vote "YES".

The interesting thing was a break in the age demographic within the 25-34 year-old bracket. They were markedly "NO" supporters. But the brackets before and after were mostly "YES" supporters. Basically, anyone who felt that they had something to lose voted for the status quo.

My own view ... as distasteful, unethical and untruthful as I found the whole unionist scaremongering campaign, it was probably effective in the end. Their badges said "Better Together"; but their lips said "we're f&%$ed on our own!". And people listened.

Looking from outside the British islands, I can not but point out the fact that British intelligence, which has rigged elections according to British interests in lots of foreign countries and established countless puppet "friendly governments" all over the world, stood this time idly watching the empire break without even moving a finger...
In short: If I have ever seen a fraud, then it is this one.

(20-09-2014 16:40 )Fritzcat Wrote:  Looking from outside the British islands, I can not but point out the fact that British intelligence, which has rigged elections according to British interests in lots of foreign countries and established countless puppet "friendly governments" all over the world, stood this time idly watching the empire break without even moving a finger...
In short: If I have ever seen a fraud, then it is this one.

laugh my cock off. Funny joke but you need post that in the joke thread.

(20-09-2014 16:02 )Goodfella3041 Wrote:  I had a good look at the returns this morning.

In short, the older and richer you were, the more likely you were to vote "NO". Younger and more working class were much more likely to vote "YES".

The interesting thing was a break in the age demographic within the 25-34 year-old bracket. They were markedly "NO" supporters. But the brackets before and after were mostly "YES" supporters. Basically, anyone who felt that they had something to lose voted for the status quo.

Would seem pretty likely. Folk under 25 are not going to be so easily scared by threats about state pension etc - they may not even have a job now; and they'll be thinking there ain't gonna be a state pension for them; the Welfare State's gonna be totally dismantled in another 10 or 15 years; or as good as.

25-34 year olds that are recent graduates with hefty loans to pay and/ or on the first rungs of the career ladder are the ones most thinking about their job prospects and trying to get mortgages etc and so are gonna be paying closer attention to the economic doom-mongering.

Over 34 : Disaffected Left-wing leaning "No supporters" old enough to remember the 1970s and 80s and general Labour uselessness against Thatcher while Scotland was deindustrialised and then used as Poll Tax guinea pigs.
Then they'll remember seeing Labour under Blair and Broon pandering to the right and now currently under Mister MilliBean being just hopeless - so they seem to be most likely group to vote "Yes" - not old enough to be drawing pensions yet and probably reckoning they're already f**ked as far as that goes so probably thinking WTF just go for it ?

Though I would say there's probably a split in that age bracket too : the ones doing well will vote NO; the ones who've not "made it" in their own eyes or got into the career position/salary they wanted by now are probably the ones more likely to have risked voting Yes.

Pensioners I would have thought would be No - more positive memory of shared UK/Unionist values and also more cautious economically. More likely to be either supporters of more gradual increased devolution of powers; or just happy to stay as is ?

Thing that gets me is - there were BBC correspondents the morning after saying "Oh well it's good news now - sterling is up against the dollar" and generally that the whole UK had been spared an economic apocalypse.

Now, regardless of whether you are English or Scottish or Pro- or Anti- Scottish Independence :

is it right that in a democracy we should be "scared" of "The Market" when we vote ?

WTF is the "Market" ? Who made it the boss ?
Naively, I always thought "the Market" was CREATED by US buying and selling things. Not that we EXISTED to SERVE it.
And that we could LEGISLATE to protect our society's weakest members and essential social services - those of which there is a consensus for - against the worst unchecked ravages of naked economic self-interest and exploitation.

Maybe we're having the wrong kind of elections.
Maybe we should be voting for who should be head of Google or Goldman Sachs or whatever, and hoping they're going to be nice to us with their policies ?

Makes you wonder if we still had children working in factories in th UK would we actually get politicians with enough guts to pass laws against it now ?
Would the electorate even vote for such politicians now ?.
Or would they be listening to their boss at the factory say "Now, now don't be silly and go voting for that or we'll just have to close the factory".

It seems like the 19th century and early 20th century reforms never happened and we all just wring our hands and go "Oh we've just got to be good little consumers and do what the market wants."

Thing is - if everyone's f**ked into the ground by the Market so that eventually there's only a handful of billionaires can afford anything - what happens to the Market then ?