Labour Leadership Contest

(15-07-2016 10:47 )schvall Wrote:  Since Labour under Corbyn isn't making the impact it should be, surely the MPs are wise to try and get more effective leadership?

Are they really doing that badly though? They did OK in the local council elections, particularly in comparison to the other parties, and have fared pretty well in the by-elections. Also, party membership has risen, and continues to rise.
No doubt they could be doing better, every party 'could' be doing better, but it's difficult fighting the guy in front when you have to keep checking behind to see who's trying to stab you in the back.

The By Elections were in Parts of Country where they Vote Labour full stop. problem is that the Ref Result have scared them because they have seen what happened on the door step and they didnt like it. they are scared that next election they will go for UKIP

The problem is that going anti blair and new labour they went to the early 80's in tone and policy. they just needed a new face to sell the old blairite message.

The referendum excuse was a lie, they'd been working on a coup for months. They haven't got a sensible alternative leader to lead them forward anyway.

^^ Yeah, I don't buy that excuse at all, this coup has been coming a while.
Plus, the people knocking on doors and handing out leaflets and actually talking to people and therefore getting feedback, are the party members, the activists, and they are for the most part behind Corbyn, after all, it was those members that voted for him.
Plus, with Farage stepping aside, I think UKIP will become an even less credible force at the next elections. After all, why vote for the 'get us out of europe' party, when we have already voted to get out of europe!

I dont know if carswell or suzanne evans become leader might come back even stronger especially in the north. get the feeling lot of people think that the torys will find a way to reneg on any brexit.

I mean look what happened in Scotland farage is like the salmond figure either hate him or love him most hated him Suzanne evans is a lot more palletable in both propaganda and in tone. so is carswell

I think a lot of the Labour grassroots dont care much for corbyn get the feeling theres the momentun the vocal minority mainly former socialist party and other trotskyist groups who saw an easy way to infiltrate the party @ 3£ a time

^ Carswell & Evans can't be the new leader of UKIP as they changed the rules to say had to be in party 5 years which ruled out Carswell & Evans is suspended.

The only way Labour will be electable is to ditch Corbyn .
Time Hilary Benn grew a pair and threw his hat in to the contest .
Afterall ,he's the one who kickstarted the revolt .
The best candidate Labour currently have that would be fit to be PM. imo .

What I don't understand is why Corbynista's think he is so good. The challengers are not arguing with him about policy although his view on Nuclear Subs and nationalising the railways might cause some split.

In the main the policies he espouses are supported. His problem is that as a leader he's like cold sick. No party can ever win a General Election on the votes of party members - the 9.3m who voted labour in 2015 need to be increased by another couple of million of the dissatisfied middle to give Labour any chance.

As Neil Kinnock said you need the support of the PLP

"Because we are a democratic socialist party, committed to a parliamentary road to power, it is vital, essential, irreplaceable, that the leader of this party has substantial – at least substantial, if not majority – support from those who go to the country and seek election to become lawmakers, the way chosen by the people who established the Labour party.

Now remember history, remember that history, remember the people that joined the party are joining a party committed to the parliamentary road and that makes it crucial to have a leader that enjoys the support of the parliamentary Labour party.

As far as I can see, Corbyn is 'proper' Labour, and if he stuck to his principles, and had the support of the PLP, he would at least provide a real alternative to the Tories; the problem, however, is that he does not have, and never has had, the support of the PLP (even though he did what they asked and tried to be inclusive when forming his original shadow cabinet, allowed Benn to speak in favour of intervention in Syria, and, increasingly, is watering down his own beliefs etc.), because they know that, it seems, the only way to get elected in England is to be a version of the Tory party, à la 'Bliar' and New Labour; in addition, the relentless bias against him by the media, and it's hardly surprising that he does not seem to be making the desired impact on the electorate.

As for the Leadership contest - So far, Angela Eagle and Owen Smith? Wow, real 'big hitters'!

(16-07-2016 14:49 )SecretAgent Wrote:  What I don't understand is why Corbynista's think he is so good. The challengers are not arguing with him about policy although his view on Nuclear Subs and nationalising the railways might cause some split.

In the main the policies he espouses are supported. His problem is that as a leader he's like cold sick. No party can ever win a General Election on the votes of party members - the 9.3m who voted labour in 2015 need to be increased by another couple of million of the dissatisfied middle to give Labour any chance.

As Neil Kinnock said you need the support of the PLP

"Because we are a democratic socialist party, committed to a parliamentary road to power, it is vital, essential, irreplaceable, that the leader of this party has substantial – at least substantial, if not majority – support from those who go to the country and seek election to become lawmakers, the way chosen by the people who established the Labour party.

Now remember history, remember that history, remember the people that joined the party are joining a party committed to the parliamentary road and that makes it crucial to have a leader that enjoys the support of the parliamentary Labour party.

I get the impression some would much rather remain forever on the outside sniping at the government. They are far more comfortable protesting with their principles safely intact unchalleged by pesky things like practicalities.