Final Crisis

Yeah but lets face it, nobody (except poor Uncle Ben) stays dead in comics anyway, even Bruce's fucking dad wasn't dead, which IMHO was the worst thing I had ever heard of in comics ever, Morrison can be a genius or a complete dickhead, that was on the highest possible plateau of being a dickhead there lol.

Bruce's dad has stayed dead! it was just Dr. Simon Hurt saying it to try and push Bruce over. I thought RIP was brill, it was all about the psychological.

Quite a few have stayed dead tho. Some were brought back due to popularity. Plus comics are all about the fantasy, so what if they bring people back?

Off the top of my head, ones that have died and stayed dead are Abin Sur, Azrael (Jean-Paul Valley), Ted Kord, Captain Boomerang, Bart Allen, Jack Drake (tim drake's dad), The Question, Gwen Stacey. But like i said, comics are fantasy, they can do what they want and bring anyone back if they want to. Most the time its either down to popularity or for a plot.

Jesus, some of them have barely been dead a couple of years, give them a chance to come back. And Jack Drake doesn't count, come on, that is like Sarah Essen being dead, they are bit parts that barely matter.

I think my list was about 50/50 and off the top of my head. I will give you Jack Drake, but the rest were fairly susbstantial and important characters! I doubt they will bring Bart Allen back, not now Wally and Barry are around along with Jay.

You could argue that some of the current ones that have come back to the dead aren't the same as they're clones, from paralell earths or time has changed so they never died.

Like I said, its comics, they're fantasy, fiction, people will no doubt get brought back, half the time it will be for good plot reasons, sometimes it won't. No doubt there will be some suprise returns with Blackest Night, since anyone that's currently dead can come back as a black lantern.

if they bring a character back, i approach it open minded, most times, its good to have them back, like Hal Jordan, Jason Todd, Ollie Queen and others.

Yeah but other times it can suck and just completely sully their death like Collossus's, and I hate Jason Todd's return lol, he is just a douche for the sake of being a douche.

I don't read much marvel, so can't really comment on that. As for Jason Todd, at first i thought it was a bit crap, but they've turned him into a good character thru the whole Countdown thing, he's got good motivation, he feels wronged in the whole thing.

There was that stupid scene in Countdown when Jason Todd, Bob, The Atom and Donna Troy were fighting people in the Palmerverse IIRC who were trying to cut them in half with swords and shit and Jason stabbed one of them in the heart and everybody stopped like it was so shocking. They were in a fight to the death for fucks sake, DC really makes it out that it is shocking the shit that Jason does but it really isn't, he seems very one-dimensional, although naming the Monitor Bob was funny.

i know what you mean, but i think it was the fact that heroes don't really kill people, well the good guys i mean, but he did. so i feel that in that context it was a big thing.

Yeah but he had killed loads of times before that, when he has killed dozens before that, it loses its effect to shock, like I remember the X-Men in the Savage Land when Wolverine 'first' kills and they seem so shocked, but within no time at all it just went without saying Wolverine kills. It was never made to seem shocking after that unless it was a huge kill, like when he decapitated Sabretooth, but that was more the fact he killed Sabretooth rather than the fact he killed. You don't see people getting shocked when Frank Castle kills, (except Micro in Punisher Max, but then that was just because of the character as opposed to the kill again), so why Jason Todd?